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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Champ View Post
    In that thread I read a lot about how they were starting cars at BIR (circulating random start) and they said it was too dangerous to start them between 11 and 12.

    Why don't they start them between 13 and 1?

    I agree it doesn't REALLY matter (the fast cars will filter to the front no matter how you start) but more curious is all.
    It mostly has to do with experience level of the drivers. For many this was their first race. It could have been absolute carnage to start their first race double wide bunched up, even between 13 and 1. I think it was a good call.

    And how to you line them up? There would be all kinds of bitching about that.
    I am now a perfectly safe penguin, and my colleague here is rapidly running out of limbs!

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by clovold View Post
    Saabs have been winning a lot other regions.
    My team piloted a Saab and had mixed success, some self inflicted

    Quote Originally Posted by clovold View Post
    In September the whole AIV thing goes away and they are assigning car values. It should be interesting to see how things shake out.
    The way Lemons does it or different? I liked that way the best. Tubby Butterman would have been laughed from the racetrack. Did they ever bring that E36 to a lemons race?

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by clovold View Post
    It mostly has to do with experience level of the drivers. For many this was their first race. It could have been absolute carnage to start their first race double wide bunched up, even between 13 and 1. I think it was a good call.

    And how to you line them up? There would be all kinds of bitching about that.
    The way we do it with motorcycles has been based on registration time. We start between 13 and 1, you can see our painted boxes on the ground if you look.

    The based on time of registration is a great way to do club/amateur racing as it helps to boost pre-reg a bit as well.

    Going into 1 is easy on start even for first timers. There is even a flagging tower there

    Although it looks like there were 55 cars? Might be interesting to fit them all there! Great turn out though, good to see the local scene getting good attendance.

    As noted though the circulating start works just fine and realistically doesn't change the outcome too much.

  4. #34
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    E36 M3s, Isettas, Vixen

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    Quote Originally Posted by Champ View Post
    The way Lemons does it or different? I liked that way the best. Tubby Butterman would have been laughed from the racetrack. Did they ever bring that E36 to a lemons race?
    I'm not sure how LeMons does it, so I don't know.

    TBR only runs Chump, as far as I know. Many in Chump seem to feel that LeMons is too much of a circus, and not as focused on real racing. I have never run LeMons, so I can't say.

    Why would they be laughed from the track?
    I am now a perfectly safe penguin, and my colleague here is rapidly running out of limbs!

  5. #35
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    We have been racing with chump for the last 3 years and just had our first podium. I will agree that in the past couple years the number of BMW's in the field have grown like wildfire. And knowing our car as good as I do, some of those other cars have got to be cheating. It will be really interesting to see what happens when the 2014 rules come out in Sept. Could cause a lot of teams to abandon whatever they are running now and scramble to build a new car. But the drivers being really good has a lot to do with it as well. Some of these guys have been racing for decades! As for the e30's being "cheaty", I can tell you that ours isnt. We havent ever placed above 10th in the past 7 races before now. Maybe our reluctance to cheat is the reason why. I was hearing rumors this weekend of an e36 on track with 240whp! I was having a great time fighting neck and neck for 3rd place with a nicely prepped mk3 (might have been a mk2) and a miata. The 3 of us had to been going at it for at least 30 mins.
    The whole weekend was a blast!

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by clovold View Post
    Why would they be laughed from the track?
    As noted I can only talk from my experience from a few years ago, but the point of (well both of these series, really) was to race "piece of shit cars" - Tubby's car was not a piece of shit, I heard lots of remarks "that's nicer than my daily driver!"

    Lemons was just handing out 1000 penalty laps to cars like that.

    Granted they were able to - with fields of 120+, if you brought ringer cars you were usually caught and the general attitude in the series is it was frowned upon.

    Chump car was not able to have this luxury, as their attendance struggled in the early years so they were not giving out penalty laps like they should have been - thus promoting a little bit nicer cars to come through. Seems like by changing their rules now they are going to try and clamp down on this type of stuff.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpkrBoxx View Post
    We have been racing with chump for the last 3 years and just had our first podium.
    Congrats! Good results are always fun especially after trying for so long. If you guys haven't yet, I urge you to go try a 24hour race, it is a whole different beast and totally worth it (even if it's a drive). Racing at night just has to be experienced.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Champ View Post
    Lemons was just handing out 1000 penalty laps to cars like that.
    Or - if they didn't get caught in inspection and went out and tore up the track, they would have gotten voted to be destroyed most likely. Not sure if lemons still destroys a car at each event or not.

  9. #39
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    There is always a lot of speculation of cheating, but that's what impound, tech inspections, and the protest rules are for.

    Call it out if you suspect cheating.

    As for me, I have done many HPDEs at BIR over the last 20 years (yes, 20 years). This is my 3rd Chump race at BIR, and my best lap time was more than 5 seconds slower than our better drivers, and they were more consistent at putting them down.

    So, a team at my experience level vs. a team of really good drivers in the same car? Let's run a theoretical race. 5 seconds/lap * 120 laps = 600 seconds = 10 minutes = 5 laps behind in a 7 hour race.
    I am now a perfectly safe penguin, and my colleague here is rapidly running out of limbs!

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by clovold View Post
    As for me, I have done many HPDEs at BIR over the last 20 years (yes, 20 years). This is my 3rd Chump race at BIR, and my best lap time was more than 5 seconds slower than our better drivers, and they were more consistent at putting them down.
    Sounds to me like you need some better instruction if after 20 years of practice you are still 5 seconds off in the same car

    The good news is racing will bring down your laptimes MUCH faster than doing track days ever would - so you are on the right track.

  11. #41
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    The new track surface was a bit tricky at first. But my track best went to a 1:54.313 this year, from a 1:56.985 last year so the track is faster for sure. But I will admit I liked the old track better though, it now almost feels TOO wide on the back side.

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Champ View Post
    Sounds to me like you need some better instruction if after 20 years of practice you are still 5 seconds off in the same car

    The good news is racing will bring down your laptimes MUCH faster than doing track days ever would - so you are on the right track.
    Well, 20 years on and off. I had kids in there somewhere. I'm not so conceited as to think that after a total of 3 actual races that I should have lap times similar to someone with hundreds and hundreds of races and a national championship under their belt. I'm happy to be within 5 seconds of that.
    Last edited by clovold; 07-22-2013 at 06:19 PM.
    I am now a perfectly safe penguin, and my colleague here is rapidly running out of limbs!

  13. #43
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    number 999 E36 has a ported head and a tune -- 240hp may have been crank hp or whp. speculation on that number I suppose but I have it on good authority that it's not stock. it wont have mattered this last weekend because it didn't podium, but had it, I bet they would have discovered some fairly serious hardware on that car.

    and that silver E30 with those forged 17"s running touareg/porsche 6-pot brakes... dafuq?

    really wished that Aurora hadn't put it into the wall, that car was a god damn rocketship.


    had a great time!
    00' BMW 323iT -- 01' Toyota MR-S -- 08' 244cc scoot-puff
    84' BMW 325e/5 24V
    -- 92' BMW 850i/6 -- 97' BMW M3/2/5


  14. #44
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    Yeah, bummer about the Aurora. We were pitted next to them, great guys.

    The 999 Fubar guy posted on the forum that he owns or works at a machine shop and builds engines, so he ported the head and basically did every trick he knew to that engine. Yup, that thing has some serious motor.
    I am now a perfectly safe penguin, and my colleague here is rapidly running out of limbs!

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2.5-12 View Post
    number 999 E36 has a ported head and a tune -- 240hp may have been crank hp or whp. speculation on that number I suppose but I have it on good authority that it's not stock. it wont have mattered this last weekend because it didn't podium, but had it, I bet they would have discovered some fairly serious hardware on that car.
    Looks like they should have spent the time/money on some brakes (or driver training / racecraft!)


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